[oclug] rogers EUA

[Brad Barnett]

On Thu, 21 Mar 2002 19:29:02 -0500 (EST)
"David F. Skoll" <dfs at roaringpenguin.com> wrote:

> On Thu, 21 Mar 2002, Brad Barnett wrote:
> 
> > > > I'm not going to look for a reference, but I assure you someone
> > > > could sue on that basis and win.
> 
> > > Are you a lawyer?  Then your assurance means little, especially
> > > without a reference.
> 
> > Are you a cop?  No, you aren't.
> 
> No.  And I won't give you advice on policing.
> 
> > You still know, however, many of your
> > rights, what the limit of the law is in many cases, and how to use it
> > to your advantage.
> 
> :-) Give me a break, Brad.  "I'm not going to look for a reference, but
> I -- a non-lawyer -- assure you I know the outcome of a lawsuit." :-)

The specific case and conditions I had mentioned previously have won
before, in similar circumstances.  I'm not just pulling ideas out of thin
air here, but I'm also not going to spend more than about 30 hours
defending my position.  I really getting close to the end of this thread..
for this week ;)

There are things you should keep in mind as well.  Our courts don't set as
much value on precedent as US courts do.  What one judge decides doesn't
really indicate what another will decide.  


> 
> > You don't need to be a lawyer to understand the law.  In fact, the two
> > separate times I've hired a lawyer, I had to help them understand the
> > law, and how to use it.
> 
> You're in the wrong profession, then.

Not at all.  It doesn't take much to be a fairly average lawyer.  The same
goes for anything else in this world.  It's only those that excel in their
profession that tend to be hard to emulate.

> 
> > I think you are placing too much importance on labels.
> 
> OK, you are not a lawyer.  You are, however, a comedian.
> 

Well, I am a funny guy at times, but I wasn't joking in this case. ;) 
Again, simple labels seem to be taken too seriously in this society.

Here is an example.  I once knew a woman that was working towards a degree
in literature (or something very similar).  I was astonished to watch her
have all of her friends help her write virtually all of her assignments. 
She would write short stories and other creative works, and spend hours
with her friends fine tuning them, to the effect that most of her work was
simply not her own.  I have also known people in computer based
professions that did the same with programming assignments when going to
school.

These people still get degrees and feel that they have earned them! 
Blasted cheaters!  These are the people that end up as "average" lawyers
and it doesn't take much to be able to do their job to the same level of
competence that they do.  They barely even recall how to tie their shoe
laces, let alone how to enact their profession.  


> > Signing a contract is a different matter.  However, my master plan
> > would make such contracts illegal.  "Power to the people!" and other
> > such rhetoric. ;)
> 
> But that takes _away_ power from certain people (ma+pa ISP's.)
> 

Yes, and large ISPs as well.  It would also give great advantages to
smaller ISPs!  For example, a small ISP can find itself in hot water over
the information that a user posts on a web page.  A small ISP has to take
punitive action quickly, even if they don't want to, or risk an expensive
judgement against them as a possibility.

If ISPs were not responsible for content, the smaller ones would be saved
from such a horrible fate.